ADHD and "bathroom problems" | ADHD Information

This child likely has encopresis, and shame on the parents for failing to address this. He must suffer regular humiliation, impacting his self-esteem. I will bump a prior post on encopresis (called Bathroom fun HA HA). He needs to go to a pediatric gastroenterologist (like SmallMom said) immediately. NoTellin38978.3943402778

This is not a symptom of ADHD or laziness and will not be "cured" with ADHD meds.  The condition this teen may have is called encopresis.  The parents should take their teen for a consultation with a pediatric gastroenterologist.   While they're at it, the parents should have their child evaluated by a neuropsychologist to make sure they're not looking at a neurological condtion beyond ADHD.  I have a hard time believing the parents didn't take their child to a doctor sooner.

 

 

I know a child that has been diagnosed with adhd, and is Not on medication. He is almoast 14, and quite freaquently "messes his pants". I guess doesnt pay attention or too lazy to get up and go until it is too late and cant make it. He does not change them, just sits in it all day...and i am not talking about urine. Parent says it is adhd and he cant control it. I think it is a combination of adhd and Laziness. How should this be handled. Am i wrong to think this is something that can be controlled without medication??  Supposedly when on medication, this problem was taken care of. but i am not sure. i think it is something that was just ignored and finally said, well, he cant help it, so theres nothing else to do.

I think this is rather odd. I can't say it has anything to do with ADHD but I wouldn't assume it's laziness either. Something else is going on here .. at least in my humble opinion. This boy is a teenager. Unless if anyone else has something else to say to support this theory, I can't understand the relation between toileting and ADHD.Thank you all for your replies. I will definately read up on this condition you mentioned. As far as i know 2 doctors have been told about this. the first one told the parents to keep up with it, and they said it went away when on adhd medication. The second doctor.....You wont believe this...At least i couldnt believe it. Told the mom to make a deal with him. if it didnt happen for a month, then he gets . as far as the humiliation. I continue to bring this up to parent. I cant imagine that nobody besides me notices the odor. And that has got to be hell on the kid. But the kid also doesnt change the underclothes at home until shower time. so sometimes i cant even feel sorry for him. at least get the dirty ones off.

I regret to inform you that it may not be this simple.

I am a 27 year old adult and I still struggle with the same kinds of problems as your friend's son. I donnot know if it is related to ADD (or ADHD) but I know that that was the only thing that the doctors could find wrong with me and I had ALOT of test done as a child. I looked up Encopresis and I know that I donnot have the symptoms listed and recall tests proving that that was not my problem.

 The people around me came to the same sorts of conclusions as you have, that I was lazy and didn't care. This is of course not the case, otherwise I would have found a way to overcome it by now. I promise it does nothing but make life difficult.

It's something embarrassing and hard to talk about, wich makes me wonder if there are others like me struggling to hide these problems. I simply wanted to present the potential other side in case the boy is like me.

Hi treetop, If he does have encopresis it isnt something  for everyone  easy to figure out. my son was 7, now 13 was dign with this his ped gas doc tryed many differnt things to help him through this. either his meds was to much or not enough. We had many test done and none helped i myself as a mom stuck with it made him do reg sittings, high fiber diets and now hes is on magnesium and omegas. We sometimes had to do cleanouts because he would become so impacted and thats when the problem starts because "he goes" and doesnt know it. It can be embarrising for some. Now finally i think my son knows we have to do these things ill admit not all days are good. but there is nothing i wouldnt do for my child.  hope u can find help for this child, im sure he gets teased at school and at 14 that has to be hard.

Heidi, get your son dxed by a neuropsychologist.  They have the knowledge and expertise to do a comprehensive dx.

That's a great point momto 1 -- our son is dx'd with ADHD and we have never had bathroom issues at all.

For those of you who have kids with urinary incontinence issues, there is also a physical cause sometimes.  My dd was diagnosed with dysfunctional voiding when she was about 3 1/2, years before the ADHD diagnosis.  It's a neuromaturational problem, and it is similar to bed wetting but with my dd it only happened during the day, except for a few incidents at night.  It started right after she was potty trained, and she began having small accidents in her pants, about an hour after using the toilet.  It wasn't related to having a full bladder, although the accidents would be larger when her bladder was more full.  She basically had small, frequent accidents, and she was often unaware that she was wet.  There are medications for this problem.  Kids usually outgrow it when they hit puberty, mine went off meds when she was 12.  Just FYI....

At one point, after her ADHD diagnosis, the ped suggested that we stop the meds for the dysfunctional voiding, thinking it was an attentional issue.....NOT!!!  It had absolutely nothing to do with ADHD, she just happened to have both diagnoses.

My son has problems too... he didn't fully potty-train until the day he
started meds. He was almost 5. He still never finishes the day with dry
underwear. One thing that mystified me was that he would come OUT of
the bathroom wet. His dad finally realized that he was holding it forever,
then it would take forever to go, and he would forget or not realize that
he was still peeing and pull up his pants and hose himself. I am told that
he is probably quite gifted, but things like that really make me wonder
some days... :) lovemysunshine,

I was also very suprised to see this topic on the boards.  While I knew it had something to do with my son's ADHD I had no idea so many people were dealing with it.  I'm glad to know I'm not alone.  Judging from the laundry, my son ends up with pee stains on his underwear most days (when he actually wears the underwear that is).  As far as bowel movements go, he tends to hold it for days at a time unless we remember to send him into the bathroom with a book or something to keep him occupied while her "tries".  Fortunately, he has not had accidents at school.  His BM's tend to be hard from holding it,  so if he does have an accident at least it's not messy and he can clean himself up without much notice.

All I can say is don't give up.   It's time consuming for me (and sometimes I forget to remind him) but it really does help to send my son into the bathroom with a book (or even his gameboy) at least once a day.   The time varies for us but almost every time I send him in he goes and accidents are avoided.  I also look for body language that tells me he has to pee...that particular type of wiggling and body posture.  When I see it I ask him if he has to go.  Most times he will say no and then head into the bathroom about two minutes later...so lately when I see it I insist that he go try.  

As for not taking him meds...I have no advice to give since my son is not yet medicated (another LONG story that you  might be able to find somewhere else on these boards).  But I wish you the best of luck :)
My son just started up with peeing in his pants again during the day. This was resolved a year ago. I suppose some may find this harsh, but I am requiring him to wear his bed alarm at all times when he is home. I know that he can control this, and I'm sure the children at school can smell the urine.

i have two boys.. one is 7 and is dx with adhd.. the other is 9, and has not been dx with anything.. my 9 year old has this same problem!  it's so frustrating.. we have been trying everything...  like devoutedtoyou said, we have to make him sit down at the same time everyday.. i find underwear hidden all the time.  we took him to the same psychiatrist as my 7 year old to see if he has adhd, and they said no.. maybe they were wrong.. he is constantly forgetting to turn in assignments.. his organizational skills are terrible..

Can't help but jump in here.  My son is ten and a half, severe ADHD/ODD.  We've had this problem from day one.  It's beginning to get a little better, finally....and I'm still praying for no relapse.  It's been the root of a million battles with he and I.  No doctor has been able to find a thing wrong with him in that area.  The best (and it wasn't good) thing I found was to MAKE him sit at about the same time every day.  I say "make" him because he would scream and cry that he didn't have to go, but I KNEW after three days, there was no way he didn't have to go.  When he finally did...he felt sooooo much better (of course).  Excuse the crudeness of this, but the size of it is astonishing, truly!  I, too, found underwear in the strangest of places.  I finally refused to wash his underwear, so he either washed them out in a bucket himself (then I would put them in the washer) or they went into the trash.  Still....it's very difficult to get the odor out of them.  I don't know why, but it stays.  I pray he will have this behind him before the age of fourteen, but I feel very sorry for the young man you're talking about.  I don't think it's anything he can help and I honestly don't believe that the child can smell himself.  I would swear that my son couldn't.......since he denied it so vehemently.  It isn't laziness........My son has had the same problem with urination.  If he gets involved in an activity, he doesn't notice that he has to go and by the time he realizes it, he's wet his pants.  It used to be really bad but now only happens once a week.  The less he watches TV or plays computer games, the less this is a problem.  We have tried to set up times everyday to go potty.  When he gets up, lunch time, after school, dinner and bedtime.  Try to limit the playstation to only times after he has gone to the potty. It seems to me that if he does this while using the playstation, then he should be limited to 30 minutes on the playstation.

Thank you Back to reality" & everyone. This is helping me try to understand everything. I wouldnt think too much about a 9 year old doing this, even though it would bring concern. I just cant fathom at 14 it still happening. So i am trying to hear from other people.

I mean he sits and plays playstation, although he is continually moving. He know when he has to urinate, so why is it he wouldnt know to have BM?

I try so hard to understand. His parent says that as an example, I can not control my depression/irritability with out medication. And that in a different way son cant control this with out medication. (Which is fine, he needs to be on meds, but he either doesnt want to, or his mom has tried to talk him into not taking. but if he doesnt want to take it, iI feel he needs to step it up and find another way to help this problem.

I am starting to see though, that maybe it isnt so easy to control. And it isnt his fault. I just see how super lazy he is anyway, and it just makes me wonder.

ANy other input is greatly appreciated, so we can figure out how to help him.

Thank You!

Treetop, I should add that although I recognize that many of my sons problems may stem from ADHD they still need to be addressed.   I have a strong educational and professional background in Behavior Modification or Applied Behavior  Analysis.   I've used all kinds of charts, timers,  and reward systems to help my kids.   To help my son avoid accidents and recognize what his body is telling him we started with a loose schedule.   He needs to go into the bathroom and "try to go"  when he gets up in the morning, after school,  after dinner, and before bed.   Usually he  ends up going  at some point even though he didn't realize the need.   It  can be useful to use a watch  with an  alarm so that eventually, the  child does not need to be reminded by an adult.   Just some tips that may be usuful to this other boy :)   Given enough time, hopefully the schedule becomes routine or the child learns to tune into his physical sensations.   My son, who is now 9 has been diagnosed with mild ADHD but has not yet been medicated.  He  has a similar problem with soiling himself on occassion.   I do think it's related to the ADHD.   From the time he was first toilet trained  (about 3 years old) he  had occassional "accidents" when he was very involved in  any activity.  Of course, we didn't know he had ADHD then.  My  son still needs to be reminded to use the bathroom  on a regular basis.  He  becomes so hyper-focused on what he's doing (especially if he's playing video games) that  he just tunes out any bodily signals that should  let him know he needs to "go".    At times he ends up soiling himself , just a little bit, before he  realizes.    This has led to him trying to hide the  problem by stashing dirty underwear in strange places.   He had even stopped wearing underwear for a while so that I would not see  the stains.    He tells me that he didn't know that he had to go.  I think he has a similar problem tuning in to whether or not he has had enough to eat.   I find it frustrating that a child of his age  is so unaware of his own bodily sensations, but then again I don't have ADHD myself.  I'm sure it's more frustrating for him Mercury--has a gastroenterologist ruled out a physical cause?

Back To Reality:

You are absolutely describing my son to a T !  My son is 8 1/2 and has ADHD and we have struggled with this pretty much all his life.  He was potty trained really late, like almost 5.  He still pees his pants pretty much everyday to a point.  He wears pull-ups to bed and always has.  I'd like to just get through a day without him not peeing.  He doesn't soil his pants that often, but he always runs so fast when he does go and ends up getting some on his underwear. He will swear up and down that he doesn't "have" to go pee and then 5 minutes later he will have peed his pants.  It is so annoying.  I have taken him to the doctors and they can't seem to find an internal problem.  Lately we been having him clean up when he misses in the bathroom, which is pretty much every time since when he does finally make it to the toilet, he can barely hold it back long enough to put the toilet seat up.  We've tried the charts, alarm, you name it we've tried it.  He has gotten better over the years and then has downfalls and then okay again, etc.  There was one time when he stayed dry for an entire week (wearing pullups to bed doesn't count) I thought thank God, finally he got with it!!!  But then back downhill it went slowly.  It's just an ordinary thing now.  Now getting him to take his medicine....thats a WHOLE other topic.

Thanks you guys for letting me hear all your stories, I felt like I was the only one  that has this problem with their child and it is so embarassing.  He is oblivious to his smell of total urination on his body.  It's crazy.  I dont know how many times I have asked him, "Do you not smell yourself"  he just shruges his shoulders.

 

 

 

My son is 10 now and did not potty train until he was nearly 4.  Up until last year, I had problems with him occassionally wetting himself at school.  He would be so busy doing school work and not notice he had to go.  At home, he will get so engrossed in play and not notice it that even now I have to call attention to his squirming, etc.  As far as a bowel movement, my son holds his.  He says that he doesn't notice that he has to go.  If you question him, then he can recall that "oh, yeah, I felt that yesterday but I was doing blah blah."  We have not had a problem with him messing himself.  He ends up constipated and by the time he does use the bathroom, it clogs up the toilet.  So I have been giving him apple juice and ovaltine (it used to make him go when he was little...).  I have been trying to get him to go more often.  He always tells me he doesn't have to go and we get into it.  I have been happy over the last week because he actually had 2 BM's that flushed normally.  I am still not satisfied with how much he goes and would feel better if he went more often.  I think it would help cut down on stomachaches.  I'm glad to know he is not alone.

There are other reasons that it could be happening, such as a physical condition, where the muscles might not be working properly.

Has depression been considered? Or another psyc problem. Autism?

(The soiling is a part of the Autism in my son, and he to doesnt care about it either, but I make sure he's sorted.  He's nearly 6.  Autism can coincide with ADHD. And it does in my sons case, where as my sons Autism is obvious, there is a scale for Autism, where there degree can vary from person to person).

The only thing I can suggest is his mother keep trying to find a dr that suits her and her family. As there is obviously something wrong.

Take Care

Louise

 

Just to throw an idea out there, since no one is an expert or anything...

Could this be a co-morbid of ADHD?  Is it too far fetched to think that our kids could actually be so engrossed in other things at the time that they never learn correctly how to tell when they have to go?  If that continues, couldn't that behavior follow them through life (if they don't learn)?  When my child has wet himself in the past, he was at school doing schoolwork.  He said he didn't feel it.  Didn't realize.  He says he doesn't realize when he needs a bowel movement.  Usually he goes after a bad stomachache and we end up with the BM from you know where.  I don't think my son is doing this because he is attached to the playstation or anything else.  He acts totally surprised when I take him to the bathroom, make him sit there and a "normal" movement occurs.  He is truly happy. 

I am working with my son to get him to understand what he is feeling and teaching him to go to the bathroom when he feels that.  Just like I had to teach him to cross the street, or to sit and eat, and all of the other small struggles we have each day. 

I don't rule it out that it is not connected.  Sure it may be Encopresis, but I don't rule out why it is happening to my son.

I am so happy to see so many posts on this topic!  I also knew this was ADHD related, but you are all describing my son!  He will have accidents primarily if he gets involved on a comp. game or Nintendo... We actually had a chart that listed "Paid attention to my body signals" & that seems to help..

Intertestingly, both my brother & I have ADD and had bedwetting issues thorugh about 13 or so.  I also recall having daytime accidents & my Mom always asking me if I had to go to the bathroom!   My boys are ADHD & only 1 has these occasional daytime incidents, but both boys (10&8) still wear Goodnites to bed...My brother's son has autism...  I', sure this is all connected up somehow.

I try not to shame my son on the accidents & just have him put the dirty stuff by the wash - I will ask what happened, what was he doing, etc... 

I truly believe that this is realated to the hyperfocusing....

 

i tink its related to the hyperfocusing too, because when i have daytime
accidents its mostly when im really into something, and i dont notice i had
an acciedent until i am done.

 That is my belief also - but it is good that you are checking into it medically as well since it seems to happen more frequently with you - Maybe you can get meds for the constipation?  My son's dr also suggested upping his fiber  -

lol. i had to get an enema and he gave me some meds to take,Kace, I think you are right about this condition being comorbid to ADHD. Dealing with it took up a huge amount of my time at one point. I got onto the tolieting forums to find answers because I literally potty trained my son for 3.5 years. He barely made it in time for kindergarten. The number of parents dealing with this problem is much much higher on this board than it ever was on the tolieting boards. I followed all of the professionals advise. It did not work b/c they were all off-target on the cause. Personally, I think it's directly related to lack of focus, distractibility, and impulsiveness. NoTellin38978.5701273148

To add... the only thing I can suggest RE smells is to tell them they have to have a shower straight after - there can be conciquences too, IE 'if you don't then your games will wait until after you do'. (Since he likes games a lot).

I shower my son after every accident - he doesn't smell when he's had one.  He too was a late trainer he must have been 4ish for the daytime, he was litterally just toilet trained in time for school.

Take care and good luck

Louise

.

Esmom38985.5076967593I know this thread is four pages long But i havent been up here for a while, I just wanted to say that my DS does this also, but he also has asbergers so i dont know what to offer really only to say that it isnt anything to do with concentration on my sons part, he know's when he needs to go, he explained it all to us about how he gets the feeling & so on. He is just uncomfortable going where he is meant to.okay i wasn't going to post here due to the fact that dillon is only 4 yrs old and he just stayed going pee in the potty a few months ago... but dillon will not go poop in the potty... he will hold it all day if he is at school or the babysitters.. and then he will only go in a pullup.. i wasn't worried about it until i started reading this thread.. oh my god what if he never goes in the potty...   what if he is still doing this at 10 yrs old.... i'm really worried now...   Just make him sit on the toliet for 15 minutes, 20 min after each meal.thats the problem.... dillon won't sit on the potty... if we try to sit him on it he freaks out.... but he isn't afraid to stand in front of it and pee... My son is 7 (almost 8) and there are times that he has a accident. My husband fuses at him. I thought at first he just didn't want to take the time from playing to go to the bathroom but then one day I ask him if he knew he had to go and he said NO. It doesn't happen alot but when it does, he hides his underwear. I started noticing it when i couldn't find his underwear when I did laundry and then found 6 pair in his closet hiden. He keeps his room clean so i usually don't go in there (our little deal) but now I do daily. I have spoken when my husbands mom and she said he had the same problem when he was a child but grew out of it by age 10. donabuzibee, thanks so much for telling us that your dh grew out of it at age 10.  My son will be eleven next month and he's still doing it, almost daily.  At least there IS hope! [QUOTE=treetop]

I know a child that has been diagnosed with adhd,
and is Not on medication. He is almoast 14, and quite freaquently
"messes his pants". I guess doesnt pay attention or too lazy to get up and
go until it is too late and cant make it. He does not change them, just sits
in it all day...and i am not talking about urine. Parent says it is adhd and
he cant control it. I think it is a combination of adhd and Laziness. How
should this be handled. Am i wrong to think this is something that can be
controlled without medication??  Supposedly when on medication, this
problem was taken care of. but i am not sure. i think it is something that
was just ignored and finally said, well, he cant help it, so theres nothing
else to do.

[/QUOTE]
I'm not sure what to do about this because i do the same thing, but not
because i am lazy but because i dont realize i have soiled myself until it is
too late. And i do it in the day and at night both wet my pants and have
bowel movements. But i do change myself. i hate having accidents!I thank you for this thread. I have a 16 yo who has been on concerta for a few years and periodically he urinates in bottles or cups in his bedroom. I have been yelling at him about it whenever it happens and I thought it was just laziness but based on the things I have read here I think it might be some side-effect of the meds (combined with his laziness to get up in the middle of the night). But maybe the concerta does increase urine flow...gives me something to think about...maybe I wont yell next time.

My 4 (almost 5) year old son has a condition that sounds very similar to this, Encopresis. We are currently going through this. (and yes, he is ADHD) I hate to be graphic but it is when a child for various reasons "holds in" stool.The "messes" are typically stool that has leaked out around the impaction that has occured. Over time, the impaction stretches out the muscle that allows one to feel the urge to go. He is now on a really powerful prescription laxative called Glycolax and uses pull-ups 100% of the time. The doc tells us that this treatment is supposed to 1) rid the impaction from the body 2) once that is accomplished, to keep everything flowing and allow the muscle to shrink back to the size it is supposed to be so that he can begin to feel sensation. This is quite an extensive process and the process is expected to take 6 months.  It was an incredibly sad decision, but my husband and I felt that it was in his best interest to pull him out of the daycare center during that time. The reason was two-fold. We didn't want the kids making fun of him or him to be self-conscious about it around the other kids and willfully hold the stool in as a result, because that would just be cyclical. Fortunetly, my mom (Grandma) has graciously volunteered to babysit for these next few months while we work to resolve his issue. Fortunetly he doesn't start Kindergarten until next year, so we are able to get a "jump start" on this problem before it causes other issues related to it (self-esteem etc.). But in your case, the young man is much older and I'm sure the battle has much more impact. I feel for him. I HAVE heard, since we have been going through this very issue, that ADHD and bowel "issues" can be related. I've actually heard of a couple of kids whose various bowel issues have been resolved once they began taking ADHD meds. I don't know, maybe because they pay attention now. Whatever, but I have heard personally of correlation in some cases. Check out Boston Children's Hospital-they have a "toilet learning school" with lots of support from psychologists etc..But the first step is this kid really needs to be evaluated. It needs to be determined if it's a medical or psychological issue-or both. There are many other reasons for this to happen other than encopresis. One that had been explored by the pediatrician in our case was "Hirschsprung's disease", but I think 14 maybe a little old for that diagnosis. Maybe not, so it's a good idea to seek a medical evaluation. One of the big questions is did this child revert or did he always "mess his pants"? Best of luck-God Speed 

Hi, my son now 13 does have encopresis. he was dx'd with this when he was 7.we tryed everything that the doc suggested, exams, mirilax u name it we done it now whats helps with us is that we uped his fiber intake. Its something like 11 plus your childs age in grams is whats recommened if im correct. fruit juices, lots and lots of water and regulaur sittings everyday 2-3 times. i will say this if my son does not go to the bathroom he will have a accident but at night we sometimes have to give him milk of mag to help. i have done so much research myself. the docs we had to take him to when he was younger i mean helped because we know have a name but it took alot of research on my part to fully understand it all. the meds the doc had him on did not help him made things worse for him because he was such a sensitive case. i am now thankful for all the research i done on this subject because i to thought it was just lazyness.